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Nations Cup 2019/20

  • Thread starter Australiarobo
  • Start date Sep 12, 2019
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K

Aland Islandskw1k000000

Champion
Feb 18, 2015
1,708
2,017
128
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #126
raxy86 said:
"Sth is part of" is a bad argument. Poland and other lands in europe were once part of NaziGermany...
Click to expand...

I am not talking history neither future in 10 years. As of now Poland is a free country, Catalonia is a state of Spain and Catalonia is just a fringe movement which is dying.
 
Athasos

GermanyAthasos

Longswordman
Jul 8, 2017
601
906
108
Hessen, Germany
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #127
kw1k000000 said:
I am not talking history neither future in 10 years. As of now Poland is a free country, Catalonia is a state of Spain and Catalonia is just a fringe movement which is dying.
Click to expand...
well gibraltar, faroe islands are both no states but compete in football ...
Also how about kosovo, Abkhazia etc, which are only partly accepted
 
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T

BelgiumTuunbaq

Halberdier
Feb 19, 2014
472
686
98
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #128
Well Suomi would have more chances without Secret or AM. Not a bad thing though.
 
E

Unknowneskimo

Active Member
May 29, 2010
240
41
28
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #129
robo said:
So that is me currently? 11
Click to expand...
why not? It's reasonable and that's why more and more show matches (invitational) happen. For NC, I don't expect to see too many teams participate. Even for China, I will be shocked if they can form more than 3 teams right now.
 
diseased

United Kingdomdiseased

Well Known Pikeman
Mar 31, 2018
114
462
78
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #130
Regarding what counts as a valid nationality to sign up as, think there are common sense ground rules that are easily established that would keep it from getting silly, e.g.:

-Player must elect to represent a presently existing sovereign state only, not any other political entity or non-state region, or defunct state (e.g. no Wales or Tennessee, no Yugoslavia or USSR, no non-state organisation like EU)
-Player's chosen state must be fully internationally recognised or at least have a firm de facto existence (e.g. Taiwan does not officially recognise the PRC or vice versa, but those two states obviously still exist, on the other hand Tibet clearly doesn't have any functioning independent government or sovereignty, regardless of the feelings of Tibetans, and breakaway regions by their definition do not pass the smell test for being recognised)
-Player may only elect to represent a single state for the duration of the event even if they have multiple citizenships (to not dilute the concept of representing one's nation and not unfairly give some players multiple chances of winning the tournament)
-if for some reason there is a credible challenge to a player's status as a national of some country, they will be required to give some basic proof of their nationality, but this isn't required out of the gate

There are surely more ambiguities but I think those few rules would squash most of the obvious ones.
 
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Poxo

SpainPoxo

Champion
Oct 27, 2012
2,807
1,443
128
Madrid, Spain
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #131
Enough with this viper can play for Germany or not, leave that for the admins on the weeks/months to come.

Now we want some real info, when is it happening? any estimation? We know it will last 10~12 weeks to play, but some players might want to decide on playing depending on when it does start.

Looking great so far @robo
 
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TriRem

FranceTriRem

Longswordman
Dec 13, 2015
731
3,654
113
27
France
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #132
kw1k000000 said:
Catalonia as a nation doesnt exist and never will in near future. Tibet is part of china.
Click to expand...
What do you do about Taiwan though? Or Hong Kong ?

Also, I like how you are extremely confident that Catalunya will never be independent. Do you have first hand insider infos about that ? Because I know literally millions who would like to know as much as you.
 
Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
green eggs

New Zealandgreen eggs

Longswordman
Jul 28, 2017
382
1,176
108
Chicago
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #133
kw1k000000 said:
Catalonia as a nation doesnt exist and never will in near future. Tibet is part of china.
Click to expand...
"Nation" is not the same thing as "sovereign state". A nation is an identity shared around things like language, historical origins, cultural touchstones etc. In academic circles it's widely referred to as an "imagined community".

There is obviously a debate to be had about whether Catalonia and Tibet (and Scotland) should be given sovereign status, a debate that I'm not going to get into. But their existence as nations is a sociological fact.
 
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SouFire

MexicoSouFire

Champion
Mar 11, 2011
3,703
2,601
128
33
Mexico
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #134
TriRem said:
What do you do about Taiwan though? Or Hong Kong ?

Also, I like how you are extremely confident that Catalunya will never be independent. Do you have first hand insider infos about that ? Because I know literally millions would like to know as much as you.
Click to expand...
The international law doesn't allow separation from a established country, especially if that country on its internal constitution doesn't allow it.

Even if you want to get independent you need the acknowledgement of the UN as a country, so you need enough vows, otherwise you will be just an independent organism.

The Hong Kong issue as you can see is far from been solved, but as long as they have enough money and allies they can keep fighting, see Israel as an example a thing violating international laws violating UN recommendations just because they have the support of the US and few other small countries but left a side the countries supporting its the money by itself and interest, the small state of Spain isn't in the same circumstances as the other u mentioned so yeah that thing to happens seems impossible.
 
Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
Huehuecoyotl22

DenmarkHuehuecoyotl22

Champion
Jun 10, 2012
17,206
6,629
128
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #135
eskimo said:
the sponsor (who donates most) should decide the main format of the event
Click to expand...
Maybe people could donate for maps, I think that has been done in the past. E. g. if you donate $500 you can choose a map to be played in the Ro16. Of course it shouldn't be Michi or Forest Nothing, but some reward, like when the TyRanT sponsor chose Land Nomad could work.
 
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TriRem

FranceTriRem

Longswordman
Dec 13, 2015
731
3,654
113
27
France
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #136
SouFire said:
The international law doesn't allow separation from a established country, especially if that country on its internal constitution doesn't allow it.
Click to expand...
en.m.wikipedia.org

Self-determination - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org
Kosovo being an example of a nation unilaterally declaring independance from its original country. Serbian constitution doesn't allow for secession under any circumstances, and to this day Serbia doesn't recognize Kosovo as in independant country while 111 UN countries do.

This to say, international law is much more a case by case scenario when it comes to declarations of Independence.
 
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G

Netherlandsgmischa

Well-Known Member
Oct 21, 2013
353
463
68
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #137
Why are we discussing all this crap instead of being hyped for ****ING NATIONS CUPPPPPPPPPPP

GOGOGO NETHERLANDS !!!
 
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TriRem

FranceTriRem

Longswordman
Dec 13, 2015
731
3,654
113
27
France
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #138
gmischa said:
Why are we discussing all this crap instead of being hyped for ****ING NATIONS CUPPPPPPPPPPP

GOGOGO NETHERLANDS !!!
Click to expand...
France will rekt whatever team Netherlands can piece together with scraps. Looking forward to seeing that.
 
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HyunaOP

United KingdomHyunaOP

Champion
Nov 4, 2014
1,734
3,696
128
31
United Kingdom
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #139
UK has no good pros

No idea why everyone is mad about what nation viper can play for or if daut Hasan klavskis and wonder and hico can merge.

We should all be like Nike and Just Do It
 
G

Netherlandsgmischa

Well-Known Member
Oct 21, 2013
353
463
68
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #140
TriRem said:
France will rekt whatever team Netherlands can piece together with scraps. Looking forward to seeing that.
Click to expand...

I understand you must have had some mouthwatering red wines before typing this.
 
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TriRem

FranceTriRem

Longswordman
Dec 13, 2015
731
3,654
113
27
France
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #141
gmischa said:
I understand you must have had some mouthwatering red wines before typing this.
Click to expand...
Nah, we just need Hera to embrace his inner Quebec and join France A and we'll wipe the floor with dutchies.

Cheers :red-wine:
 
Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
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dodageka

Germanydodageka

Champion
Feb 13, 2018
1,425
2,707
133
  • Sep 14, 2019
  • #142
Make South Korea great again
 
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Memeluke

ItalyMemeluke

Champion
Nov 9, 2016
1,065
3,008
128
  • Sep 16, 2019
  • #143
So much drama about TheViper playing for Germany and nothing about Nicov carrying Italy to top 8 :cry:
This is so sad.
 
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King_Marv

GermanyKing_Marv

Champion
May 27, 2016
1,005
2,263
128
31
Germany
  • Sep 16, 2019
  • #144
why is there a discussion about "nations" before even a single person asked if he/she could represend Catalonia. ??? This was not a problem in the last Nationss cup why would it be in this one?

And since when does moving to another country mean the same as having that nationality or the ability to represent it??
 
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Marteens

SpainMarteens

Well Known Pikeman
Oct 21, 2018
206
416
78
  • Sep 16, 2019
  • #145
King_Marv said:
why is there a discussion about "nations" before even a single person asked if he/she could represend Catalonia. ??? This was not a problem in the last Nationss cup why would it be in this one?

And since when does moving to another country mean the same as having that nationality or the ability to represent it??
Click to expand...

I think so, this is just a game.
 
M

GermanyMichaerbse

Halberdier
Oct 14, 2017
834
2,103
98
32
  • Sep 16, 2019
  • #146
King_Marv said:
And since when does moving to another country mean the same as having that nationality or the ability to represent it??
Click to expand...
Since there are no defined rules yet about this matter. Residence could theoretically be enough if it is defined that way and there are multiple sports where you don't need to have the respective nationality to represent a nation.

I do agree though that it is kind of useless to discuss some of the topics mentioned in this thread without any reason. Although it may be better to discuss it now than when it's too late and drama has already started.
 
King_Marv

GermanyKing_Marv

Champion
May 27, 2016
1,005
2,263
128
31
Germany
  • Sep 17, 2019
  • #147
Michaerbse said:
Since there are no defined rules yet about this matter. Residence could theoretically be enough if it is defined that way and there are multiple sports where you don't need to have the respective nationality to represent a nation.

I do agree though that it is kind of useless to discuss some of the topics mentioned in this thread without any reason. Although it may be better to discuss it now than when it's too late and drama has already started.
Click to expand...

Many sports? I don’t know any but I’m interested.. can you name some ?:smile:
 
M

GermanyMichaerbse

Halberdier
Oct 14, 2017
834
2,103
98
32
  • Sep 17, 2019
  • #148
King_Marv said:
Many sports? I don’t know any but I’m interested.. can you name some ?:smile:
Click to expand...
Ok, looks like "many" was an exaggeration - I guess I was assuming so because there are so many changes of nationality in sport where people just obtain citizenship of the other country despite having no bonds to it.

One example is chess though, the regulations say the following:
"A player may be registered under a Federation if he or she has citizenship, naturalization or residency in the country of that Federation."
 
buhanisson

Finlandbuhanisson

Longswordman
May 29, 2015
741
2,327
108
  • Sep 17, 2019
  • #149
In real life, changing citizenship is a very slow and difficult process because of national security, immigration laws, taxes yada yada. A person may feel that place X is their home long before that process is finished (if it ever is), and I really fail to see any reason why any of that would relevant for an aoe2 nations cup. Isnt it proof enough of your love for country X that you are dedicated to win the nations cup for it? (As there is a prizepool, maybe not quite enough, but a very good start nonetheless)

Football rules are football rules and dont necessarily precede common sense.
 
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C

Czech RepublicCZ_Mango

Halberdier
Dec 14, 2013
560
810
98
33
Prague
  • Sep 17, 2019
  • #150
HyunAOP said:
UK has no good pros

No idea why everyone is mad about what nation viper can play for or if daut Hasan klavskis and wonder and hico can merge.

We should all be like Nike and Just Do It
Click to expand...
I think UK can easily field a solid 2k+ team which is better than in the past.
 
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