I like the less range thing, might make crossbows and mangonels more viabel against them, I would also still reduce their attack by one or two points more.
But nefing them slowly is the best so I would either do -1 attack or range not both at the same time.
I think not even a wood to food cost will solve this, and they need a complete redesign. IMO it's worth considering giving them a massive damage nerf and accuracy increase in return. Attack somewhere in middle between a cavalry archer and conquistador (say 10, 14 elite) and higher accuracy (50-70%).
Which is why decreasing their attack will work, it will make Knights/Camels able to actually go in and snipe Mangonels while you have Crossbowmen/Elite Skirmishers behind to kill the Arambai.I think the biggest problem with them is that they completely destroy any melee unit. If you're a civ like Franks or Teutons and you're up vs arambai you're pretty much dead already, as you have literally nothing that counters them well. Archer civs do better vs arambai but struggle vs arambai+onager combo.
IMO if you make the unit cost food, or increase its reload time, then it just becomes too similar to conqs. They need to be unique otherwise there's no point in them existing in the first place.
Yes definitely true, decreasing the attack would help with this too.True words.
* + arambai can kill enemy mangonels much better than xbows aswell*
Yes! Vietnamese shouldn't lack Husbandry, Burmese should.Burmese should lose husbandry at least.
It also keeps them being completely OP against every melee unit and every non-ram/treb siege unit. Civs without good archers will still suck vs them.I like the idea of making them lose their pierce armor. It nerfs the unit pretty heavily while still maintaining the unit's identity of a powerful, but inaccurate glass cannon
I agree with this thoughMaking them cost food makes them feel too much like Conqs imo
The biggest problem i have with these mounted ranged units is that they are so hard to stop once they can raid your eco easily. You can wall or tower up but you still will lose villagers while casulties for the arambai/conqs will be minor. Suggested counters are always way slower (monks, archers,rams,onagers) and with the high damage the conq/arambai does monks and mangonels are pretty much hit and miss. I dont really see a good way of balancing these units. I already think standart cav archers (that require a lot of upgrades to get strong) are too hard to deal with, since they have both speed and tankiness. (Even if you catch them with a mangonel or a mass of archers/skirmisher) they can just run.
The only ways i can think of to nerf the CA types that dont require upgrades (but are made from castle) is: lower their health (similar to plumes, atleast these die to a mangonel shot or when running into a mass of archers/skirms). Decrease the speed (making them more like tanky archers than speedy raiding units) or make it even harder to mass or to get upgrades for them (increase cost, traintime or add extra upgrades that they require) if I think completely out of the box adding a speed/health/accuracy upgrade in castle would make them harder to use, grabtibg the opponent more time to prepare and making these units more vulnerable to counters (before they have the upgrade).
(I voted for extra cost btw since I think this is the most conventional way to nerf this unit that benefits from a early powerspike)
Yes definitely true, decreasing the attack would help with this too.
IMO Arambai should have 14 attack in castle age, not 17 attack. This means vs Knights they take 12 shots to kill them instead of only 10 shots, vs Camels take 10 shots rather than 8 shots to kill, and vs Mangonels it would be 7 hits rather than 5 hits.
Why increase their accuracy though? Surely they'd still be too strong after this? And wouldn't they be too generic since they'd be similar to other gunpowder?I think maybe even less attack but therefore a bit better accuracy, somewhere between cav archers and conq, but with less range than a CA, like asdf stated above.
Why increase their accuracy though? Surely they'd still be too strong after this? And wouldn't they be too generic since they'd be similar to other gunpowder?
I think the biggest problem with them is that they completely destroy any melee unit. If you're a civ like Franks or Teutons and you're up vs arambai you're pretty much dead already, as you have literally nothing that counters them well. Archer civs do better vs arambai but struggle vs arambai+onager combo.
I think not even a wood to food cost will solve this, and they need a complete redesign. IMO it's worth considering giving them a massive damage nerf and accuracy increase in return. Attack somewhere in middle between a cavalry archer and conquistador (say 10, 14 elite) and higher accuracy (50-70%).
This way castle age arambai don't straight up counter fully upgraded heavy camels/paladins, which is the most ridiculous thing ever.
CHU KO NUUUUUIt is also worth noting that there is no ranged unit in the game that has attack around 10 in castle age