The first bit about David has already been addressed so I need not go into that.You being Hindu or not isn´t relevant, the relevant thing is that those were crimes based on religion, sorry but the Quran is not the cause of why these guys are exploding themselves to kill inoccents, it is just a poor excuse, I am Catholic, and do you know that David, one of the greatest men according to the Bible, was a ruthless killer and wiped out all the lands conquered, including all the forms of torture by his army?, if I want I could find some not nice texts in the Bible and turn to the "dark" side, but nobody is interested right now in the Christian world and put the Bible as an excuse, we instead use Democracy, Oil, Drugs, etc,etc.
I agree wholeheartedly with the last statement.Speaking of religion, someone had put it quite wittingly;
If you believe in your hallucinations, its called lunacy
If you believe in someone else's hallucinations, its called religion.
I hope coming generations question everything they are told and not accept them as "belief" or face value. Less believers means one less factor to divide us.
I agree wholeheartedly with the last statement.Speaking of religion, someone had put it quite wittingly;
If you believe in your hallucinations, its called lunacy
If you believe in someone else's hallucinations, its called religion.
I hope coming generations question everything they are told and not accept them as "belief" or face value. Less believers means one less factor to divide us.
With regard to the first statement, with regard to Christianity, I find it very hard to beleive that so many of the early Church would WILLINGLY suffer such tortures for a hallucination.
True...Why people takes prides in their religion which they didn't select by themselves but are forced to follow that as they born in particular family. People should be open to discussion and should not get offended if any questions raised on any religion.
'most terrorists are indeed followers of Islam' yea the ones we are told continuously about. The only terrorist states however are Christians and Jews such as Israel, and tons of security agencies like blackwater from America are by all means terrorists yet we dont hear about them enough
I am not sure why you think your way of thinking is the only way of thinking and you would much rather have people think things that way. I am a hindu born a hindu. I have read hindu scriptures and there are several things I like and some of the things I hate, the things I hate I do not practice them at all. Why? coz I think I have my own judgement of right and wrong which is beyond religion and comes from a thing called humanity. I have several islamic friends and can attest to the fact that they are all peace loving normal people much like me. Pretty sure the people who are radicalized are not as such just because there is a book where it incites people to fight. In my experience there is always a circumstantial need which has led people to go rogue. Some atrocity done some where, some deep rooted issues. E.g. The current raqqa bombings by france is causing civilian causalities. If I as a kid in raqqa sees my immediate kin die in this act of war off course i will become anti france. Doesn't matter what is written in what book. Net net what I am saying origin of terrorism far transcends religious books and have deeper origins than what media chose to publicize. Lets not get swayed by it and lose our power of judgement in this process.True...Why people takes prides in their religion which they didn't select by themselves but are forced to follow that as they born in particular family. People should be open to discussion and should not get offended if any questions raised on any religion.
The vast majority of people are their religion simply because they were born to an X religion parents. When you actually appreciate this fact, you can start to question your own religion.
This is good. There could be an argument about where your judgment of right and wrong originates and a question to raise that you understand that not all muslims are what your experience of them is but I do not think it is necessary to go there.I am not sure why you think your way of thinking is the only way of thinking and you would much rather have people think things that way. I am a hindu born a hindu. I have read hindu scriptures and there are several things I like and some of the things I hate, the things I hate I do not practice them at all. Why? coz I think I have my own judgement of right and wrong which is beyond religion and comes from a thing called humanity. I have several islamic friends and can attest to the fact that they are all peace loving normal people much like me.
The thing Carlos has been talking about in this thread is not that radical muslims only become terrorists because their holy book tells them to.Pretty sure the people who are radicalized are not as such just because there is a book where it incites people to fight. In my experience there is always a circumstantial need which has led people to go rogue. Some atrocity done some where, some deep rooted issues. E.g. The current raqqa bombings by france is causing civilian causalities. If I as a kid in raqqa sees my immediate kin die in this act of war off course i will become anti france. Doesn't matter what is written in what book. Net net what I am saying origin of terrorism far transcends religious books and have deeper origins than what media chose to publicize. Lets not get swayed by it and lose our power of judgement in this process.
Your reply has almost nothing to do with my point you quoted. All im saying is people who staunchly defend their religion with whatever interpretations they can come up with, needs to appreciate the fact that mostly its due to the simple reason they are born as Muslim Christian or hindu for example. Your statements like there are a majority of peaceful muslims is not something I disagree and makes me tired seeing this point made everytime.
Here they are again and if you want i can give more..The unfortunate fact is that Islam has a LOT to do with how ISIS behaves today. Here is why:Hating Islam is the worst possible thing to do. Why do you let radical groups like IS represent the entire religion? Radical Christian groups such as the KKK were/are distanced entirely from Christianity, and the same needs to be done here.
I understand that the first response is to attack the religion as that is the rationale of these groups, but the truth is they aren't true followers of the religion. Taking their actions as a representation of the entire religion will cause more harm than good.
As per Quran:
8:12 to 8:14 - [Remember] when your Lord inspired to the angels, "I am with you, so strengthen those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip." That is because they opposed Allah and His Messenger. And whoever opposes Allah and His Messenger - indeed, Allah is severe in penalty. "That [is yours], so taste it." And indeed for the disbelievers is the punishment of the Fire.
8:36 to 8:39 - Indeed, those who disbelieve spend their wealth to avert [people] from the way of Allah. So they will spend it; then it will be for them a [source of] regret; then they will be overcome. And those who have disbelieved - unto Hell they will be gathered. [This is] so that Allah may distinguish the wicked from the good and place the wicked some of them upon others and heap them all together and put them into Hell. It is those who are the losers. Say to those who have disbelieved [that] if they cease, what has previously occurred will be forgiven for them. But if they return [to hostility] - then the precedent of the former [rebellious] peoples has already taken place. And fight them until there is no fitnah and [until] the religion, all of it, is for Allah. And if they cease - then indeed, Allah is Seeing of what they do.
9:29 to 9:32 - Fight those who believe not in Allah, nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the Religion of Truth, from among the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. The Jews say, "Ezra is the son of Allah "; and the Christians say, "The Messiah is the son of Allah." That is their statement from their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved [before them]. May Allah destroy them; how are they deluded? They have taken their scholars and monks as lords besides Allah, and [also] the Messiah, the son of Mary. And they were not commanded except to worship one God; there is no deity except Him. Exalted is He above whatever they associate with Him. They want to extinguish the light of Allah with their mouths, but Allah refuses except to perfect His light, although the disbelievers dislike it.
9:63 to 9:68 - Do they not know that whoever opposes Allah and His Messenger - that for him is the fire of Hell, wherein he will abide eternally? That is the great disgrace. They hypocrites are apprehensive lest a surah be revealed about them, informing them of what is in their hearts. Say, "Mock [as you wish]; indeed, Allah will expose that which you fear." And if you ask them, they will surely say, "We were only conversing and playing." Say, "Is it Allah and His verses and His Messenger that you were mocking?" Make no excuse; you have disbelieved after your belief. If We pardon one faction of you - We will punish another faction because they were criminals. The hypocrite men and hypocrite women are of one another. They enjoin what is wrong and forbid what is right and close their hands. They have forgotten Allah, so He has forgotten them [accordingly]. Indeed, the hypocrites - it is they who are the defiantly disobedient. Allah has promised the hypocrite men and hypocrite women and the disbelievers the fire of Hell, wherein they will abide eternally. It is sufficient for them. And Allah has cursed them, and for them is an enduring punishment.
9:73 to 9:74 - O Prophet, fight against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be harsh upon them. And their refuge is Hell, and wretched is the destination. They swear by Allah that they did not say [anything against the Prophet] while they had said the word of disbelief and disbelieved after their [pretense of] Islam and planned that which they were not to attain. And they were not resentful except [for the fact] that Allah and His Messenger had enriched them of His bounty. So if they repent, it is better for them; but if they turn away, Allah will punish them with a painful punishment in this world and the Hereafter. And there will not be for them on earth any protector or helper.
9:111 - Indeed, Allah has purchased from the believers their lives and their properties [in exchange] for that they will have Paradise. They fight in the cause of Allah, so they kill and are killed. [It is] a true promise [binding] upon Him in the Torah and the Gospel and the Qur'an. And who is truer to his covenant than Allah? So rejoice in your transaction which you have contracted. And it is that which is the great attainment.
9:123 - O you who have believed, fight those adjacent to you of the disbelievers and let them find in you harshness. And know that Allah is with the righteous.
As per Muhammad's teaching in Islamic Hadiths:
Sahih al-Bukhari 2797 - "By him in whose hands my soul is! I would love to be martyred in Allah's cause and then come back to life and then get martyred, and then come back to life again and then get martyred, and then come back to life again and then get martyred."
Sahih al-Bukhari 6484 - "It is not permissible to shed the blood of a Muslim who bears witness that there is no god except Allah and that I am the Messenger of Allah except in one of three cases: a soul for a soul (i.e., punishment for murder), a married man or woman who commits adultery, and one who leaves his religion and separates from the jamaa’ah (main body of Muslims)."
Sahih al-Bukhari 6922 - Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to `Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Messenger (peace be upon him) forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire). I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Messenger (peace be upon him), "Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him."
Sahih al-Bukhari 6924 - "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: La ilaha illallah, and whoever said La ilaha illallah, Allah will save his property and his life from me."
Sahih al-Bukhari 6930 - Whenever I tell you a narration from Allah's Messenger, by Allah, I would rather fall down from the sky than ascribe a false statement to him, but if I tell you something between me and you (not a Hadith) then it was indeed a trick (i.e., I may say things just to cheat my enemy). No doubt I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "During the last days there will appear some young foolish people who will say the best words but their faith will not go beyond their throats (i.e. they will have no faith) and will go out from (leave) their religion as an arrow goes out of the game. So, where-ever you find them, kill them, for who-ever kills them shall have reward on the Day of Resurrection."
Sunan ibn-Majah 2763 - The Messenger of Allah said: "Whoever meets Allah with no mark on him (as a result of fighting) in His cause, he will meet him with a deficiency."
Sahih Muslim 4366 - "I will expel the Jews and Christians from the Arabian Peninsula and will not leave any but Muslims."
I have never came across any verse from Quran that encourages killings of innocent people. In fact, there is verse that says even if you are in a war, do not kill unarmed civilians, women, kids, elderly people and people who are not willing to fight.
I have never came across any verse from Quran that encourages killings of innocent people. In fact, there is verse that says even if you are in a war, do not kill unarmed civilians, women, kids, elderly people and people who are not willing to fight.
As for the christian fundamentalist, its a matter of which verses you put emphasis on and which one you choose to not practice. There is no "peaceful" religion. its a myth. Even buddhists killed people in Myanmar.
5:32 - Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land – it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one – it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors."whosoever kills an innocent human being, it shall be as he has killed allmankind, and whosoever saves the life of one, it shall be as he had saved the life of all mankind."
Qur'an 5:32
Do not kill a person because Allah has forbidden killing
Qur'an 6:151
“And do not kill yourselves. Surely, God is Most Merciful to you.”
Qu'ran 4:29
“And do not throw yourselves in destruction.”
Qu'ran 2:195