I think brits is good civ, they don't need bloodlines or paladin at the moment
brit is not comparable at all with byz. Brit has a darkage economy bonus, cheaper tcs and a very useful military bonus as flank, byz doesnt. Byz might have arbs and siege ram, but there is no eco or military bonus that supports you in the early game, which relativates it.
brit is not comparable at all with byz. Brit has a darkage economy bonus, cheaper tcs and a very useful military bonus as flank, byz doesnt. Byz might have arbs and siege ram, but there is no eco or military bonus that supports you in the early game, which relativates it.
Why do you not consider having cheaper counter units to be an eco/military bonus?
Crazy. I could probably count on one hand the number of civs that have a better balance than Byz right now, weaker and stronger civs should be trying to get closer to where they are not the other way around.
As for catas... they're a very situational unit. Super expensive sure, but if the game plays out vs infantry-heavy compositon in which they are needed they are more than worth it. Reducing price isn't going to make them viable in more civ matchups it's just going to make them completely OP in the rare situations where they are feasible.
Having a bonus on trash is far less valuable than a bonus on xbow/Knight line in teamgames (cus of trade and the fact that KT/Xbow combo is the strongest combo u can have (Or ele/xbow) during castle age and early imp)
And you cant use the byz bonus to snowball your eco.
It's not a bonus on trash, it's a bonus on counter units. Xbows and KTs might be quite strong but they do not trade very well into eskirm or pikes/camels respectively. How are the food savings a Byzantine player gets building these counter units as part of a strategy to frustrate their opponent's Castle Age aggression not something that enables to them to boom more strongly during that time?
Well said I never talked about pocket/ flank btwByzantines are a very decent flank civ - why the desperate need to turn them into a pocket civ/make cavalry play viable for them? Buffing their cavalry can take us down to routes: either their cavalry is still weaker than their archery line and their trash, then the buff won’t have much impact or their cavalry becomes stronger, and then the civ is turned upside down
Byzantines have so many strengths and they are so variable that they have a place on almost all maps in almost all situations.
i'm sorry, but what is that for a shitty statement. You cant make skirms/pike in TG, if you do that you die miserably, you simply dont make trash units in TG, like at all. Flank always goes archer than xbow and pkt scout then kt. Have you ever played a TG?
Yes, but that is irrelevant. I'm basing what you quoted off what I've seen/heard while watching casts of professional TG. Are you saying the logic I've heard there is wrong?
Show me one professional game where someone went full pike skirms in feudal AND castle age (already rare) as TG flank, where he didnt completly die. I havent seen or experienced one.
And yes your logic is wrong. Full skirms and pike as flank is not viable.
What is the relevance of this request?
Can you explain why that is so I can understand where "my" logic went wrong?
Well you are stating nonsense/weird stuff and once someone is asking why, you dont want or cant give a proper answer.
Classic aoeforum behaviour.
Last try. So you state that you trade well with skirms and pikemen as byz flank vs kt and xbow. This is simply not true and if you play like that you die most likely. Then you reply that its first irelevant (i dont know why you say its irrelevant) and second that you saw expert games and heard casters say pikemen skirm is a viable/good combo as byz flank.
Then i ask you for a proof of that and you ask why a proof is relevant. Well you state something untrue or at very least strange, so some proof for it who said that or in which game this worked would be good. You dont give a proper answer at this and just evade the question. This kind of behaviour is found plenty on aoeforums.
They would do fine on full random / blind random i guessIf you go skirm+pike as flank in any decent tg you are not only killing urself but your pocket and team, simple as that, there is no need to explain why, it might work 1 of 100 times if there is FWD and a huge skill gap.
I like how ovenka says they are a good civ and you need brain to play them but that he wouldn't pick'em, that is the definition of a bad civ among better civs.