your punishing us for posting the game how its supposed to be posted, and adding tyrant point of view once we revied it, your ****ing pathetic all of you admins who think this is not completely unnessecary and bullshit.
you say "post both pov immediatly after game", i posted them both immediatly when they were ready, who gives a **** if i recieved tyrants later and posted it, we had people asking us for recs even after the first game, so why should i make them wait all day to see recs? because admins make stupid rule? im sickened by all of you and if it was a 1v1 tournoment i would have quit the tournoment already because of your **** admin behavior, a bit to convenient that Dreams on another team running for the top spot gives the other top team "tyrant" 2 P.P. already. yeah real ****ing convenient isnt it.
I will take this reply as a base for the discussion.
This topic is focused mainly in Penalty Point discussion generally. But obviously games CsK vs Tyrant will be involved and Pyc vs Indus games where P.P's were given.
First of all, I would like to say something about the P.P's. We increased the amount of P.P's which leads to disqualification, because we wanted a real tool to have an impact in clans behavior in WCL. Three misbehavior in total for a disqualification. We also didn't want to start handing out P.P's straight away. You can see that in Qualification Stage and first round of Group Stage we gave multiple warnings over posting recs and other behavior. So for real it's more than just 3 misbehavior's.
Apparently the system about posting recorded games has been overwhelming for some clans and operators. They feel strongly against it. We wanted the recorded games renamed and posted through this pattern, because we feel that we want to take brave steps towards better tournament system and to bring the best experience to the whole community. We had an option, which was that operators send their POV to admins and admins post the topic to avoid mistakes. This was abandoned, because we want to keep admins free for making other important decisions and keeping the tournament running. This is debatable and it's possible that we might consider going to this option. We will have to talk with the admins about it but for now we will go with the current system.
Once again, these things are debatable if you do it in a civil manner.
About Case CsK vs Tyrant:
Recorded games were posted Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:30 pm. Around Sat Jun 18, 2011 1:23 am the games were still renamed incorrect. Games are still renamed wrong "WCL7 Group A R1 StorM (POV) vs PiA G1 Arabia.mgx" versus "WCL7 Group A _CsK_ (pov) vs Tyrant G1 Arabia.mgx". There was no Tyrant's POV available still at this point. I had a reason to believe, that Tyrant POV has not been given to CsK. I also had probable cause, that CsK has posted the recorded games without Tyrant POV, which is against the rules.
You can see that the first post has been edited 4 times in total by Spring and last edit is "Last edited by Spring_ on Sat Jun 18, 2011 5:34 am, edited 4 times in total". Recs are still renamed wrong CsK side.
I messaged Kkab right after the games to send the files to Spring. And Kkab said that he will send them. Apparently it has been totally CsK's fault the games weren't posted at this point and I have been unaware of this fact. That's why Tyrant's P.P will be lifted with Prophet's decision. Giving them P.P was tough to me anyway, since Kkab my very good online friend. For Tyrant it would have been second time when this happens, so giving P.P was the only option since the rule is still enforced. Apologies to Tyrant's.
Summary (facts):
- Spring posted the recorded games renamed incorrect.
- Spring posted the games before having Tyrant's POV (You need to wait until you have other clans POV before posting. Or you need to message admins, that you didn't get their POV).
- Tyrant gave their POV to CsK inside a reasonable time limit.
- Tyrant P.P is lifted.
- CsK has been warned earlier about posting recorded games incorrect. (viewtopic.php?f=420&t=63649&start=10).
Spring: DJY and CSC are both clans who aren't native english speakers, but they still manage to post their games correct without the extra drama and complaining. If they don't know how, they ask us. I think it's pretty fair and reasonable from our side what we have done now when you look at the facts. You can call us names and make ad hominem -comments all you want, but these facts still stay the same.
I think that case CsK vs Tyrant is pretty solid after taking Tyrant's P.P away. But what is debatable is the recorded game posting rule. Apparently it's too much for some clans to do it right or have the time to do it.
Edit: Given that I also messaged Kkab to send the recorded games to Spring (instructions and a warning) it was pretty reasonable action to give them a P.P at that point.