So, DE brought several balance changes in vainilla units. For me the biggest one was the nerf on elite battle elephants attack, from 16 to 14, due to their overwhelming power in TG. I agree with this change and logic, because 16 attack it was indeed too much, but again, wasn't that change, totally crippling?
Let's check the unit values: a ton of life. (more than the double amount of life a knight have) More expensive in food than a knight, about of the same cost of gold. 2 more attack in castle age, 1 less meelee armor. same attack, and pierce armor in imperial (comparing it to the paladin), otherwise, 2 more attack and 1 more pierce armor than cavs.
Looks good on paper. So, why we don't even see elephants, except for khmer elite battle elephant in TG, and cheap battle elephants for malay, in 1v1?
And I came to the conclusion that, regardless it might look, Elephants are far from being the unstoppable force they seem to be at first glance.
Some say "they're too expensive to make in castle age" and yes, they cost lots of food, but again, with the attack and life advantages they should compensate with knight line in equal resources. Yes, it's true that you might want to raid with knights, which is not the idea with elephants. Still, why Burmese and Khmer usually go for knights?
And the answer is obvious : speed.
Knights and elefantos share the same counters: halbs and monks (and camelsz until certain point).
The thing is, knights can chose fightsz deal damage and outrun counters. Elephants no. In castle age, when you can afford a few elephants, monks can doom you in a second, and elephants won't be able to run. In imperial age, EBE extra life doesn't matter, since they can't outrun halbs, whom destroy them in the most cost-effective way of the game.
In hd edition, Burmese was supposed to be a elephants civ, why? Because elite battle elephants had this 16 attack, and burmese had a decent eco to create them (both viets and khmer didn't). Now this civs have both good eco, so why we still Don't see elephants?
Because with elephants you always risk to waste a ton of resources.
I think elephants should be faster. 0.9 speed would be good. That way, with Husbandry, they would be able to catch vils, and will have the same speed that halbs without squires.
Think about it. When was the last time you saw Burmese or viets playing elephants, despite their elephants being "highly usable?" only khmer with their extra 15% get to use them (and even so, they seem kinda slow). Of course this bonus should be adjusted according to the new speed of the unit. What do tou think?
P. S: this also explains why Burmese seem that weak: they specialize in 3 situational units (infantry, monks, elephants), while having generic knights and bad archers.
Let's check the unit values: a ton of life. (more than the double amount of life a knight have) More expensive in food than a knight, about of the same cost of gold. 2 more attack in castle age, 1 less meelee armor. same attack, and pierce armor in imperial (comparing it to the paladin), otherwise, 2 more attack and 1 more pierce armor than cavs.
Looks good on paper. So, why we don't even see elephants, except for khmer elite battle elephant in TG, and cheap battle elephants for malay, in 1v1?
And I came to the conclusion that, regardless it might look, Elephants are far from being the unstoppable force they seem to be at first glance.
Some say "they're too expensive to make in castle age" and yes, they cost lots of food, but again, with the attack and life advantages they should compensate with knight line in equal resources. Yes, it's true that you might want to raid with knights, which is not the idea with elephants. Still, why Burmese and Khmer usually go for knights?
And the answer is obvious : speed.
Knights and elefantos share the same counters: halbs and monks (and camelsz until certain point).
The thing is, knights can chose fightsz deal damage and outrun counters. Elephants no. In castle age, when you can afford a few elephants, monks can doom you in a second, and elephants won't be able to run. In imperial age, EBE extra life doesn't matter, since they can't outrun halbs, whom destroy them in the most cost-effective way of the game.
In hd edition, Burmese was supposed to be a elephants civ, why? Because elite battle elephants had this 16 attack, and burmese had a decent eco to create them (both viets and khmer didn't). Now this civs have both good eco, so why we still Don't see elephants?
Because with elephants you always risk to waste a ton of resources.
I think elephants should be faster. 0.9 speed would be good. That way, with Husbandry, they would be able to catch vils, and will have the same speed that halbs without squires.
Think about it. When was the last time you saw Burmese or viets playing elephants, despite their elephants being "highly usable?" only khmer with their extra 15% get to use them (and even so, they seem kinda slow). Of course this bonus should be adjusted according to the new speed of the unit. What do tou think?
P. S: this also explains why Burmese seem that weak: they specialize in 3 situational units (infantry, monks, elephants), while having generic knights and bad archers.
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