Wouldn't it be great if the next big Age Of Empires tournament was a Nations Cup 4 vs 4?

[StringerBell]

I was watching this series https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrBja_HYSx0&ab_channel=TheViper and let me tell you my man, the Nations Cup of 2017 was a great a Tournament!

 

[SouFire]

Nation cups is one of the reasons why the devs keep adding civs, appealing to the nationalism of the players, there aren't enough pro players from different regions to make it inclusive, only like 6 countries have chances to compete and the rest are out including tons of pro players.

We already know the final would be china vs finland, brazil third, then argentina, china b, canada and thats pretty much everything, despite norway has strong players they don't have chemistry, so i guess for such small group of players a showmatch would be better.

Boa was a nice tournament but if we have right now another tournament like that, the results could be identical or maybe just AM vs soumi at the end, cause during this year only finland has got a new top player(valas) the other teams are the same, given the fact that there aren't team games at top level like in the past(voobly) a lot of teams and players haven't improved that much or trained hard without a proper TG ranked system.

 

[Faraday]

Don't get me wrong I loved 2v2 World CUP but I did not have the feeling of a nations cup.
I would love too see a Nations Cup with a mix beetween 3v3 and 4v4 with RM and EW.

 

[teutonic_tanks]

NC 4v4 RM would be the dream, maybe a few 3v3s as well, but at least 50% should be 4v4.
No 1v1s or 2v2s mixed in and preferably also no EW (its not the end of the world, if there is 1 game EW or a EW HM per set)

And please dont come here and say "4v4 is ToO LaGgY" that's not true at all, it's 100% fine.

 

[Snizl]

Not a big fan of 4v4 tournaments personally. As a viewer I find it very hard to keep track of what's going on, who has the lead and who is on the back food. It just doesn't elicit the same emotions smaller scales do. But well, no harm done in having a tournament, I just won't be excited about it.

As was previously said however, 4v4 nations cup simply does not work, due to availability of players. We already had DauT and Lierey excluded from the 2v2 world cup due to lack of availability of team mates.

 

[willdbeast]

We already know the final would be china vs finland, brazil third, then argentina, china b, canada and thats pretty much everything

Damn Vietnam don't even get a mention 24

 

[OLADUSHEK]

Poor Lierey, he don't have 3 2k5+ teammates.. No chanse for Austria then

 

[MembTV]

Improve ladder, performance, and everything related with the TGs in the game and then maybe a 4v4 event would make sense.

Also a lot people would not play since they don’t have team and honestly 80-90% of the games would be one sided since only few teams can really put a competitive 4v4 team.

I loved nations cup back in the days, casted them all and got a lot hype but now for me sadly the situation is different.

 

[amazing_knight]

Some of my favourite TG tournaments were:
1. Nations Cup 2017
2. Battle of Africa 2018 (or was it 2019?)
3. Clan Masters 2016
4. WiC (Battle between TyRanTs)

Would love to see a 3v3 or 4v4 tournament soon - Nations cup or Clans, I am happy with either.

 

[Huehuecoyotl22]

It is largely also a question of sponsors. How much do you need nowadays for an S tier 3v3 or 4v4 tournament? A lot. SY hosted Nations Cups because China was thought to win. I think the best chance would be a WWP sponsored Nations Cup.
Nations Cups even out a bit what team based 4v4 would do with competitiveness.
For a Nations Cup, it should be closer than in 2014-2017, especially after the top 3-4 and it was definitely interesting to see who reaches top 8, etc. already, not only who wins.

We all thought we would get one in 2020. As it did not happen, I hosted the 2020 AOElympics, but if we could get a 4v4 Nations Cup in 2022, I would want to be involved. But who gives $50k+?

 

[Lord_patito]

It is largely also a question of sponsors. How much do you need nowadays for an S tier 3v3 or 4v4 tournament? A lot.

I'm not sure about it. Yeah, prizepools have got a lot bigger lately, but at the same time, nations tournament is not always for the money (at least, money it's not that much important in comparison with other tournaments).
In addition, I can only think in 4 composed by 4 top players: Finland, China, Brasil and Vietnam. And probably the last two are less expensive that europe/U. S so surely smaller prizepools are more appealing there than here. (Idk about China).

Other countries with elite players (Austria, for example) could get an arrangement to give a bigger part of the prizepool to their best player.

Let's take Argentina, for example : yeah, Nicov is used to get good money from tournaments. Same goes for Capoch. But the 3th and 4th players (probably Fedex and Twigg, or maybe Biry) while being amazing players, usually don't get into the main event of S-tier tournaments. So at the end is more money of what they will be getting in a 1v1 s-tier tournament.

Long story short, I think pretty much all top players would probably sign in

 

[HongeyKong]

4v4 = stack = too few contending teams

 

[SuperskinnyBLS]

Im dying to watch another Nations Cup. Incredible format, unforgettable matches. To this day I remember China EMA going full madlad vs Finland and getting 2-2 I believe :D

 

[nC_Andorin]

Absolutely! People also tend to forget that Nationscup isn't only about the top 4 teams, just look at the amount of sign ups from the previous editions. I always had a ton of fun playing even if we were a weaker team. There is a reason many countries field so many players, not to win but to participate and have fun.

Performance wise I don't think its as bad as people make it out to be (maybe on the ladder) but private games are more playable than on Voobly. I have been playing on a potato Laptop the past months and the game runs fine until late game.

 

[SuperskinnyBLS]

Vivi, CL, Tim and Geoffrey... tears stream down my face. I miss them as well. What a team

 

[Faraday]

Absolutely! People also tend to forget that Nationscup isn't only about the top 4 teams, just look at the amount of sign ups from the previous editions. I always had a ton of fun playing even if we were a weaker team. There is a reason many countries field so many players, not to win but to participate and have fun.

Performance wise I don't think its as bad as people make it out to be (maybe on the ladder) but private games are more playable than on Voobly. I have been playing on a potato Laptop the past months and the game runs fine until late game.

agree 100%. Even knowing as a ~~2k player I would not win at all, I would love to participate with my friends and see how far we can do.

about the top four teams, It was the same back in 2017. China, Finland, Brazil, Vietnan... I don't understand why it is a problem now. Just look at the team games tournaments we have had in the last three years. Everyone knew AM, and Secret (back then) would make into them final likely. Maybe Suomi, WWP or Heresy could step up. The "problem" with of only have 4 or 5 favorites team is no exclusevly of a nations cup instead it is always been a thing in tournament games. Look even more in to the past. WCL and the others. We've always knew that only 4 or 6 teams that could step up in the semis and final.

About performace, I understand it is far from perfect but it is doable an least in my pov (A viwer and a bad player)

 

[Ovenka]

I would love that, NC is one of the best tournaments possible and 4v4 is the best format, also playing for your country is great imo

 

[Huehuecoyotl22]

I'm not sure about it. Yeah, prizepools have got a lot bigger lately, but at the same time, nations tournament is not always for the money (at least, money it's not that much important in comparison with other tournaments).
In addition, I can only think in 3 composed by 4 top players: Finland, China, and Vietnam. And probably Vietnam is less expensive that europe/U. S so probably smaller prizepools are more appealing there than here. (Idk about China).

Other countries with elite players (Austria, gor example) could get an arrangement to give a bigger part of the prizepool to their best player.

Let's take Argentina, for example : yeah, Nicov is used to get good money from tournaments. Same goes for Capoch. But the 3th and 4th players (probably Fedex and Twigg, or maybe Biry) while being amazing players, usually don't get into the main event of S-tier tournaments. So at the end is more money of what they will be getting in a 1v1 s-tier tournament.

Long story short, I think pretty much all top players would probably sign in

Yes, but SY Nation's Cup 2 and 3 had funds around $50k already. For NC 3, some of it was used for the players for flights, hotels, etc., but having a $5-10k Nations Cup in 2022 would feel small. And there are not many people or companies who give more than $10k for an AoE II tournament.

 

[Influenza]

Most streamers and organizers don't like to deviate from what they know works. Hence we basically see the same exact 1v1 tournament on repeat with a few deviations here and there.

Maybe someone might sponsor an uncompetitive show match of what appear to be the top two countries if you're lucky. I would be very surprised if we saw a $30k+ 4v4 tg tournament of any settings in the near future. But I would also like to be proven wrong about this.

 

[Lord_patito]

Yes, but SY Nation's Cup 2 and 3 had funds around $50k already. For NC 3, some of it was used for the players for flights, hotels, etc., but having a $5-10k Nations Cup in 2022 would feel small. And there are not many people or companies who give more than $10k for an AoE II tournament.

Yeah, but nowadays the standar big tournament is at least 20k in prizepool. I believe is more than enough to make a competitive world cup. Let's not forget that pro players are also playing tournaments with far smaller prizes

 

[Dauty]

3v3 is superior to 4v4 in almost every way I think. Easier to follow, more teams can be created, etc.

Not a fan of nations cup because the lack of inclusion of Daut/Lierrey, among others, who are personally my favorite players (and big draws overall).

 

[King_Marv]

3v3 is superior to 4v4 in almost every way I think. Easier to follow, more teams can be created, etc.

Not a fan of nations cup because the lack of inclusion of Daut/Lierrey, among others, who are personally my favorite players (and big draws overall).

This is just stupid. They can form a Team, probably not a one with good chances but in football there are a lot of teams playing which have no chances at all from the beginning. I know that everyone who participate get some money since there is a lot on the line but when you get 50k or something for a 4v4 Nations cup you could just reward top 32 with 500$ from default. There is no need to give the first team 20k and exclude all others. Just make a proper price share.

 

[Snizl]

This is just stupid. They can form a Team, probably not a one with good chances but in football there are a lot of teams playing which have no chances at all from the beginning.

Well, if you like to see these kind of teams formed...

Sure, you can make the argument that most countries teams will actually be quite bad, because there are very few countries with multiple people in the top 100, but then again what fun is it to watch how DauT teams up with some 1300 players? And how much fun is it for the players to play such an event.
I think the Norwegians have at least some contact to other Norwegian players as well, but i don't know how much this is the case for other nations. Playing with someone way below your skill level, that you don't have any relation too/had no prior contact probably isn't exactly a great experience.
If we want to see a 4v4 tournament I don't think the limitation of a nation's cup should be put onto the players, to me it just feels like an arbitrary exclusion of players based on the country they are born/live in and again will probably lead to a lot of pointless drama about eligibility to participate in certain teams.

 

[eC_Gurke]

agree 100%. Even knowing as a ~~2k player I would not win at all, I would love to participate with my friends and see how far we can do.

about the top four teams, It was the same back in 2017. China, Finland, Brazil, Vietnan... I don't understand why it is a problem now. Just look at the team games tournaments we have had in the last three years. Everyone knew AM, and Secret (back then) would make into them final likely. Maybe Suomi, WWP or Heresy could step up. The "problem" with of only have 4 or 5 favorites team is no exclusevly of a nations cup instead it is always been a thing in tournament games. Look even more in to the past. WCL and the others. We've always knew that only 4 or 6 teams that could step up in the semis and final.

About performace, I understand it is far from perfect but it is doable an least in my pov (A viwer and a bad player)

Well worded point. The "not enough competitive teams" argument is always there for 3v3/4v4 events. Nothing to do with nations cup.

 

[Pinch3Terneira]

TG is a lag fest with extremelly repetitive cav moving in front of archers battles. Also the market make the late game too long and boring.

I dont have interest on this.