Tournament ELO

[JoshuaR]

The bar graph on your site really shows how Viper stands alone at the top. Amazing work

 

[mungo__]

The bar graph on your site really shows how Viper stands alone at the top. Amazing work

Thank you

I will work on some interactive tools, as compare two given players, or "walk back in time" to analyse AOE history. There are many things that would be nice I think.

 

[mungo__]

I might begin by first testing what the actual within-series correlation is, and maybe compare it to within-day correlation in normal rated games, to see if there even is a real problem there. To me it seems a desirable thing that a way longer series brings at least a bit more points than the shorter one.

Hey again, I made a copy of the database in JSON, SQL and ODT (Spreadsheet) format. A within-series correlation would be very interesting to have

Database: On the right top corner

 

[mungo__]

Hey guys! There are some new things online:

• A more detailed career overview on the player profiles
• The ability to compare any players!
• Some smaller beauty fixes

Let me know what you think! And especially, what we could add on the compare page

 

[Michaerbse]

Hey guys! There are some new things online:

• A more detailed career overview on the player profiles
• The ability to compare any players!
• Some smaller beauty fixes

Let me know what you think! And especially, what we could add on the compare page

The comparison looks great!

I don't know what to add in the comparison itself but I feel that the option should be placed more prominently on a couple of other pages. E.g. when you are at a player profile, the only way I found of comparing him to someone else was at the "Most frequent opponent" section. I think it should be somewhere at the top, maybe right below the graph.

Also I think it would be great to show the maps on which the games have been played, e.g. when you hover on the result of a series it would display something like
"1. Arabia 1:0
2. Rooster 0:1
3. Hideout 1:0
4. Bay 1:0"
(not sure whether this has been said already and not sure whether the current data basis allows for it)

Edit: Just had a look at the data and it doesn't seem like it is possible right now. Are only the overall match results stored and not the single games alone? I think it would be worth to store data on the games as well to allow for some even more fancy stuff but this would probably require a larger update...

 

[Bergui]

Hi , thank you for your site , it is amazing !

I spotted a little problem : when you sort by elo changes , it sort by the first number :
for example , if i sort by best --> worst changes , it looks like :
+9 ,+9,+8,+7,+5,+45,+4 ,+33 , +3......
And in addition , the unmodified ratings appear in weird places (at the beginning and not in the middle for example ) .
I hope it will be easy to fix .

ty

 

[mungo__]

I don't know what to add in the comparison itself but I feel that the option should be placed more prominently on a couple of other pages. E.g. when you are at a player profile, the only way I found of comparing him to someone else was at the "Most frequent opponent" section. I think it should be somewhere at the top, maybe right below the graph.

You are right! I put the comparison next to the leaderboard and will probably add it to the player profiles, too soon.

Also I think it would be great to show the maps on which the games have been played, e.g. when you hover on the result of a series

Yep you said it yourself, unfortunately this data is not in the database yet, only overall series results. But I will soon start to extend the database to add maps and signle game results, maybe recorded games. Would be also interesting to know which player is good on which map!

Hi , thank you for your site , it is amazing !

I spotted a little problem : when you sort by elo changes , it sort by the first number :
for example , if i sort by best --> worst changes , it looks like :
+9 ,+9,+8,+7,+5,+45,+4 ,+33 , +3......
And in addition , the unmodified ratings appear in weird places (at the beginning and not in the middle for example ) .
I hope it will be easy to fix .

ty

Thank you! I fixed everything (a couple day ago when I read your comment.) Should be working correctly now.

 

[daehiise]

Awesome Website, good work!

 

[JoshuaR]

Amazing! Thanks for your effort. This is a great tool.

 

[Jarvin]

Jordan with higher placement than Vivi or Tim though, huh

As much as this is obviously understandable, consdering that Jordan used to be top #1, I feel like this makes the current leaderboard slightly inaccurate.
Perhaps instead of trying to take games from over 4 years ago into consideration it'd be better to find more newer showmatches, tournaments that could be added into the ranking?
Or maybe TG tournaments could be added in some way?

 

[nimanoe]

Jordan with higher placement than Vivi or Tim though, huh

As much as this is obviously understandable, consdering that Jordan used to be top #1, I feel like this makes the current leaderboard slightly inaccurate.
Perhaps instead of trying to take games from over 4 years ago into consideration it'd be better to find more newer showmatches, tournaments that could be added into the ranking?
Or maybe TG tournaments could be added in some way?

Even though I agree that Tim and Vivi should probably be placed higher than JorDan, I don't think adding TGs will fix this, it will probably only make things worse as he always teams with Secret :D
And I don't think showmatches are really representative of the skill of the players, so I'd rather not see them added.

One thing that could work is to add a decay in some way, although I'm not sure if that's entirely in the spirit of this ladder and I have no idea how much of a decay would be desirable
Another thing that could work is just to wait till there are some more matches played, since the rankings should balance out eventually.

 

[Huehuecoyotl22]

Does every result have a year and month (and day) added to it?
Then maybe you could add a filter to the ladder: Include results only from yymmdd to yymmdd. That might not be the most important thing now, but it would be a good addition and way to show ratings of only a certain year or time period.

 

[Jarvin]

Does every result have a year and month (and day) added to it?
Then maybe you could add a filter to the ladder: Include results only from yymmdd to yymmdd. That might not be the most important thing now, but it would be a good addition and way to show ratings of only a certain year or time period.

I think that'd be super calculations-heavy, as it'd require recalculating results for every single game and player everytime someone uses that filter

 

[Huehuecoyotl22]

I think that'd be super calculations-heavy, as it'd require recalculating results for every single game and player everytime someone uses that filter

You're right. Then maybe just for every year.

 

[mungo__]

Hey guys! Thanks for the input!

Jordan with higher placement than Vivi or Tim though, huh

I agree that there are some surprising placements, also RiuT being Top5. But That vivi is above Jordan is caused by the actually not good results by Vivi in the last tournaments:
- Actually not amazing results by vivi (for example losing to Fire in HC1)
- The quite good comeback of Jordan (I think is ranking being #11 is not a lot too high)
- That currently the Elo decay is only for "retired" players: As soon as somebody plays again, it is removed. I think I modify this and also include a softer decay on several months of inactivity (as for example for jordan)

You are right that including showmatches would maybe be interesting, however it is really difficult to judge when a showmatch is really played seriously. We seriously plan on adding them though.

Does every result have a year and month (and day) added to it?

Almost, yes. And for the rest, the approx. dates are known.

Then maybe you could add a filter to the ladder: Include results only from yymmdd to yymmdd.

I think that'd be super calculations-heavy, as it'd require recalculating results for every single game and player everytime someone uses that filter

Yes, that's the problem. But one thing that might be possible would be just including certain years - this way I could cache the results without recalculating them everytime. But I think this feature will have to wait for now... Showing the ladder at a certain time in the past is easy though (but not solving your problem).

 

[mungo__]

Oh and we have some new features:

• A "Compare Players" panel is now next to the players list as @Michaerbse suggested. I will add it to the player profiles, too.
• The series cards have hidden details now. I thought they were a bit too confusing. You can still view the individual game Elo changes by clicking on "Show Details"
• The tooltips on the Elo Development Graphs are much clearer

Karl

 

[archxeon]

Great to see Hidden Cup also being added. If Hidden Cup wasn't single elimination, it would be interesting to see the ratings change for each character. Still by the semis and final, it might provide some insights for the top 4/2 players. And obviously after the identity are revealed.

 

[GWLeibniz]

Hi, is there a way to report errors of game results on the website? If so I haven't found it - anyways, in the NAC1 MBL vs. Liereyy groupstage match is a mixup, it says 4:2 for MBL, should be the other way around (https://youtu.be/fpP_W85Nj4c?t=3h17m14s)

 

[Michaerbse]

Hi, is there a way to report errors of game results on the website? If so I haven't found it - anyways, in the NAC1 MBL vs. Liereyy groupstage match is a mixup, it says 4:2 for MBL, should be the other way around (https://youtu.be/fpP_W85Nj4c?t=3h17m14s)

https://aoe-elo.com/about > Mailbox > "What's up?" = "Fault in the data"

Good catch btw 11

 

[Michaerbse]

Oh and we have some new features:

• A "Compare Players" panel is now next to the players list as @Michaerbse suggested. I will add it to the player profiles, too.
• The series cards have hidden details now. I thought they were a bit too confusing. You can still view the individual game Elo changes by clicking on "Show Details"
• The tooltips on the Elo Development Graphs are much clearer

Karl

Thanks, looking good! Could you add a text search for the player names in the "Compare players" box with instant filtering (same as for the leaderboard, just within the dropdown)?

 

[mungo__]

Thanks, looking good! Could you add a text search for the player names in the "Compare players" box with instant filtering (same as for the leaderboard, just within the dropdown)?

Good idea. I will try to make a thing like that.

Hi, is there a way to report errors of game results on the website? If so I haven't found it - anyways, in the NAC1 MBL vs. Liereyy groupstage match is a mixup, it says 4:2 for MBL, should be the other way around (https://youtu.be/fpP_W85Nj4c?t=3h17m14s)

Thx! For future errors you can use the mailbox as @Michaerbse said, or just post it here as you did

 

[mungo__]

Hey,

do you think DERAC is serious enough to be included?

I would say yes, but didn't have much time to follow it yet...

 

[Michaerbse]

Hey,

do you think DERAC is serious enough to be included?

I would say yes, but didn't have much time to follow it yet...

Well it's only 2k3+ players and a decent prize money. I'd definitely include it. I also think Aspiring Experts (Gold League) should be considered. It's 2k - 2k4 and would provide some more data on players that occasionaly appear in tournaments like KotD. Generally, imo every tournament that's 2k+ only can be considered.

 

[The_Night_Panda]

Hey,

do you think DERAC is serious enough to be included?

I would say yes, but didn't have much time to follow it yet...

Would it be possible to add a feature where you can choose to see what the elo’s would be if you only included certain tournements?

That would give people a tool to get around if they think certain tournements shouldn't be included. It would also give options like seeing the elos of arena clowns on arena only compared to other maps only.

 

[mungo__]

Would it be possible to add a feature where you can choose to see what the elo’s would be if you only included certain tournements?

That would give people a tool to get around if they think certain tournements shouldn't be included. It would also give options like seeing the elos of arena clowns on arena only compared to other maps only.

The problem with this kind of feature is the heavy calulation overhead. To calculate a player's Elo, we need the Elo of all his opponents in history. The Elo of the opponents is affected by the Elo of their opponents, etc. The current calculation time is not too crazy, only some seconds. But if would have to be done every time someone adjusts the list.

However, as so many people suggested it, I might implement it with a bit of caching...
Possible filters would be:
- Tournaments included/excluded
- Time frame
- any other ideas?

mungo