SF - TheViper vs MbL

UnknownCuth

Active Member
May 18, 2014
130
200
43
#51
Isn't the "aoc universe", especially when you look at AoEZone alone, also out of this world, kind of? A small community, gathered around a 20 years old game, generally consisting of mature and intelligent people who more or less know and respect each other (to the degree that is possible through an internet community). And aren't that good conditions for being a little bit more considerate than the rest of the world?

I'd like to set the following story against your "opening the news after football game" analogy: Imagine Jane comes home late from work, and as usual, she mindlessly takes a seat in the living room, where her family already is who just watched said football game. The family members know Jane would like to watch the recorded match tomorrow. Should they try not to talk about the result of the match (if they want to do so, they can ask Jane to leave) or should they tell Jane that it is a mistery to them how she dares coming into the living room if she doesn't want to have any spoilers?

As I said in my response to Nicov, I also think there is no right to complain in the sense of claiming to be morally wronged by people who spoil the result. But one is certainly entitled to ask for reconsideration, just the way I did with my reaction to Edie's post, who then made the winner's name disappear from the surface of his post.
as if girls watch football

horrible analogy
 
Mar 28, 2018
46
44
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#52
One thing to consider in this discussion about it being unfair to the other players playing "trolly": Viper participated as a streamer in this tournament (as did MbL), therefore his job is to entertain his stream and not as much to win. Most of the times he still wins, but a playing style that he considers more fun, interacting with viewers, ... shouldnt be considered disrespectful in my eyes.

PS: I'm pretty sure he didn't lose on purpose, rather used a non-optimal strategy that didn't work in the end, because his opponent was too good.
 

MexicoSouFire

Well Known Pikeman
Mar 11, 2011
2,600
138
78
29
Mexico
#54
It was arabia and huns, viper has never been the #1 under those settings, anyway he was streaming and not walling so who knows if he was even trying.
 

GermanyAthasos

Longswordman
Jul 8, 2017
553
785
108
Hessen, Germany
#58
I watched the second and third game.
The second game was mildly interresting, but mbl was really defensive and the Tarkan only switch was a total throw in my eyes.
The third game was really boring, Viper played standard without walls and mbl super defensive with walls.
It was not interresting to watch this game and it was kinda easily won by the snake.
I don't know about the other games but for me the way mbl played (full wall into scouts) was super boring to watch.
It's a well deserved victory nevertheless but the settings aren't fun to watch (for me).
I also watched the previous rounds of viper, but those were as boring as the semi, at least the tati rush against spring was something funny, but it felt extremeley disrespectfull and I didn't like it therefore.

It would have been extremely boring if viper went for walls into casle age boom as well, so he at least tried to make it more interresting.
I don't think it was any better but this thread of butthurt viper fanboys was a little laugh :wink:

Anyway mbl has beaten viper now two times in recent tournaments and for me this proves, that he can challenge the very top.
I am looking forward to see more great perfomances from him in future ECL tournaments.
 
Likes: GWLeibniz

Mexicomalamadre

Known Member
Jul 15, 2014
182
175
48
#59
I watched the second and third game.
The second game was mildly interresting, but mbl was really defensive and the Tarkan only switch was a total throw in my eyes.
The third game was really boring, Viper played standard without walls and mbl super defensive with walls.
It was not interresting to watch this game and it was kinda easily won by the snake.
I don't know about the other games but for me the way mbl played (full wall into scouts) was super boring to watch.
It's a well deserved victory nevertheless but the settings aren't fun to watch (for me).
I also watched the previous rounds of viper, but those were as boring as the semi, at least the tati rush against spring was something funny, but it felt extremeley disrespectfull and I didn't like it therefore.

It would have been extremely boring if viper went for walls into casle age boom as well, so he at least tried to make it more interresting.
I don't think it was any better but this thread of butthurt viper fanboys was a little laugh :wink:

Anyway mbl has beaten viper now two times in recent tournaments and for me this proves, that he can challenge the very top.
I am looking forward to see more great perfomances from him in future ECL tournaments.
You dont get it. Huns war have been 'boring' for years now. They are supposed to always be the same thing.
If people want other kind of games, well there's a lot to chose from. But for once in a couple of years, huns whores wanted a 'boring' tournament, with scouts, CA, knights, etc.

Let's not make it a big deal, at least now we will have the final with serious huns whores.
 
Likes: ManchildTV

GermanyAceW

Active Member
May 30, 2018
37
40
33
#62
There is a difference between "trolling" and trying bold and/or risky strategies. Both strategies employed by Viper in the first two games could very well have worked but MbL simply played better in the end (game 2 players were still neck and neck towards the end with Viper even having a better economy than MbL). While he admitted himself maybe trying "non optimal" strategies, Viper played the games 100% and did not hand the victory to MbL on a silver plate; it's not like he threw the games on purpose

What would you have wanted him to do? Play standard meta - if there is such a thing in WK Huns war -, wall and turtle up like a maniac? Would that have made the games more interesting to you? I haven't finished watching the series but the first two games were both close and entertaining. Game 1 can show how to fight in feudal against a castle age opponent (even if Viper ultimately fell short) and game 2 was action packed from minute 10.

Both players should be given more credit. MbL for winning convincingly against the best player in the world, and Viper for putting up a great show.
Just because he is live commenting and seemingly having fun while playing the game doesn't mean he isn't 100% focused on winning (besides, he probably likes winning too much to throw games).

Amen.

It's a little bit ridiculous when people complain about Viper playin' like he did. They tend to forget that Viper is skillfull enough to make almost "everything work".

I guess the same people would've complained if Viper would've played the the usual Huns meta through all the games.
 

Unknownorangereaper

Active Member
Aug 21, 2014
115
239
43
#63
Here is my 2cents (or the minor currency denomination of your choice).

So the gameplay didn't go against the specified rule-settings.
This may force more veribage in the upcoming or ongoing tourneys.
Then again a ~$200 tourney can only put up so much hurdles.

Does it go against the spirit of the law, its upto interpretation.
We saw similar drama from SY/Vivi/Yo, albeit in context of BOA.
End of the day for players like Viper (wonder who else we can put in this category), with over 1000 subscribers keeping his/their stream-viewers happy is paramount. There was not enough on the line, looks like.

In contrast I can recall Viper's game against Jordan in NAC. Jordan was the lowest seeded player and was expect to finish last let alone challenge Viper. In one of the game, Viper just 'gated' all the skirms to their demise and eventually quelling any chances Jordan may have had.

So yes, there is a difference in the seriousness these games were played.

Personally, I dont mind some banter but would always prefer a much quite serious game than one with too much 'troll''/'fun' (no matter the result).

All of us have been hoping for a serious BoX games between 2.4k+ player, and when we get a chance we get this .......
 
Jul 29, 2018
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#64
Just watch the reps, i think we might overreact a bit.

First, the whole tournament was a fun-prioritized game, the other SF is also a battle of throw., so why claim people trolling just because they are not performing at very best? full try hard mode also annoys ppl

Alsp, players should be given rights to test new strategies in smaller tournaments, though some of them turns out to be bad, the effective ones then become meta in larger tournaments. which will ultimately help the game to further develop

But I do not want to take away anything from mbl, he played fearlessly and execute his own strategies very well, he deserves to be in the final.
 

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