NAC 3 Main Event - All Info

Marteens · Jan 3, 2020

Hunyadi_ said:
Damn right!

?

Bowserlord · Jan 3, 2020

malamadre said:
Well that was an asshole move, unethical, unprofesional. But whatever, who cares just 5 random dudes on forums and 3 of the top 15 players in the world.

Hope they dont get unmotivated, tournament will be fun but lots of questionable **** happening.

now everyone can see your low iq... well done

TheCapybara · Jan 3, 2020

I feel like a lot of the arguments around this stem from different people having different ideas about what this tournament is designed to be.

People treating it as an opportunity to watch some high-level play in a slightly less formal setting seem happy because we're getting another very good player and dedicated member of the community added into the mix. Those wanting the tournament to be a professional, competitive tournament in the mould of KotD or HC are disappointed because the decision to add Hera lacks transparency and consistency compared to the standards applied to other tournaments. I can understand both sides.

NAC will always be a bit of a different style tournament for various reasons (being a LAN event, getting visas, small space etc.). Obviously Nili is inviting people into his home, so he has to be comfortable with them.

What I would suggest is that this tournament is DE's first opportunity to be showcased extensively. We have some of the world's best players, motivated to play hard for a respectable prize pool. We have a selection of high-profile and high-quality casters who can give the games the necessary hype and analysis to engage both casuals and enthusiasts. They're expecting well in excess of 10,000 viewers, which would be fantastic.

NAC3 is less a tournament for prestige, but more of a grand showcase event. It grows the game in different ways to events like ECL, mainly appealing to a broad audience rather than developing the competitive scene so directly.

The big concern is how AoE2 moves on from here for future tournaments. If NAC3 is a big success and DE works and continues to improve, future tournaments with this level of funding need to offer a fair chance to all players to have a chance of qualifying and participating. There need to be clear criteria and transparency so everybody is on a level footing.

Huehuecoyotl22 · Jan 3, 2020

Can anyone help me with the information about the Meet & Greet? The Discord link does not work for me. Was there another post with place and times?

Chrazini · Jan 3, 2020

Huehuecoyotl22 said:
Can anyone help me with the information about the Meet & Greet? The Discord link does not work for me. Was there another post with place and times?

How dare you ask a question not related to the drama?! We need more fuel.

baffoe · Jan 3, 2020

I’m also just a casual viewer and from an outside view reading this thread I get a strong feeling that the criticism in here is first and foremost about disappointment that some people are not participating rather than actual worries how tournaments get more successful and professional – because there are obviously dozens of more important factors than if an invited player is allowed to play last minute as 9th player or not.

But be that as it may, in general I find it quite ironic, that a way towards more professionalism on an individual level for players/casters who have a problem with a tournaments host decision making would be just to contact him directly instead of making public negative comments in a forum.

SouFire · Jan 3, 2020

Hera increases competition but at the same time reduces the gold income for our lord and possible earnings of the other players in there, that could be probably the only issue i see.

Jarvin · Jan 3, 2020

Just gonna leave it here
people who geuninely believe in AoE2's potential to become "an e-sports", unless they define it as "mostly niche, but still decently popular, game with some competitive scene" are delusional. AoE2 just straight up doesn't have what it takes to attract broader audiences, and it'll never have. We can, obviously, try to make predictions on what are AoE4's chances of becoming that magical "e-sports"(pretty low IMO) but as far as AoE2-related discourse goes, I don't think if it should be ever brought up in all honesty. So to people who state that we need to strive for bigger professionalism(or anything, really) "if we want AoE2 to be an e-sports", it's probably not a very valid argument.
This community has survived over past years almost solely thanks to being relatively small & cozy, if you look at current top AoE2 content creators, very few of them attract their audiences thanks to how "professional" they are, as most of them do it by just being open, having a cool personality trying to be close to their audiences(look: T90's community games or Nili constantly asking the chat if someone has some questions, or Memb with his... talkative and active style of casting & playing).

For a potential new player who has played AoE the last time 10+ years ago it's the sense of nostalgia that may draw him back to the game, not some hype-ass tournaments played on a big-ass stadium with a huge-ass prize pool
For someone who had never heard of the game in the first place, no matter how hard we try, the 'professionality' or hype tournaments won't attract him to the game longer than very briefly ever, period.AoE is simply always going to be extremely behind other games, be it SC2, LoL, CSGO or whatever else

So IMHO the only thing that can feasibly attract more players to the game right now is... to keep doing exactly what we are right now: be open, cool, be more about shared satisfaction and sense of doing something great together rather than faked competitiveness.

On a slightly different note, I'm personally very afraid of the prospect of AoE2 suddenly becoming massively popular, as I simply can't resist the sense that if that were to happen everything we value this game for right now would just die or become irrelevant.

So back to the topic of Hera..
Of course that the decision to bring him in is weird purely from the "competitiveness" POV
Of course this will make the organization of the tournament itself pretty weird, given how now there won't be an even number of players and
Of course there were other ways to solve this.

But in the end inspite of all that I'm very happy, as I feel like this "this might not make us look too smart but we'll do it anyways because it's cool" is what makes this community great in the first place
and the fact that @Nili_AoE had even the 'balls' to do it and communicate it with us, even knowing that some would be unhappy with this decision, only shows how closely linked are all parts of the ladder of this community to each other
+I think Hera is certainly going to provide in the end, and we will for sure see some great games from him

And lastly
I don't think if this going like "it's understandable that this happened because M$ wants money" or "For Nili all that matters are viewers so of course he wants Hera in" is a very good attitude.
Truth is, we never know anyone's real intentions nor what is actually happening behind the scenes, so we shouldn't pretend that we know more than we actually do as this rarely leads to something good .-.

Enjoy and pax :smile:

Crawsack · Jan 3, 2020

_srini_IVIaIVIa_ said:
Nobody who has been around a while would put down dogao and F1Re like that.

I think they're excellent players, but they are not at the same level as the top 10, that doesn't mean I'm insulting them. Player's abilities and ranking is also pretty fluid, we've seen some new players emerge in the last year or two, and even since DE was released, and some of the most experienced and decorated players in the community don't play as much anymore and so have fallen off. This is pretty normal for competitive gaming. Just because someone is/was a good player doesn't mean I can never critique them.

Chirris_ · Jan 3, 2020

ChristheCo said:
I am of course no-one in aoe community, but i still think that you are more a crier, that a pro player. You always blame others, why you can't get into top tier tournaments or showmatches. There are top much invitatitionals, etc.
You are saying that aoe needs to be more professional, yet in which fantasy world would be more than 10 best players get invited to a LAN? You could get into Escape LAN, but you didnt, you could get to NAC3, but you didnt, So instead of crying, maybe try training more, and maybe then youll get into them.

DUUUUUUDE, dogao won the Nations Cup, he is TOP PLAYER, dont say none sense just for talk.

Crawsack · Jan 3, 2020

Chirris_ said:
DUUUUUUDE, dogao won the Nations Cup, he is TOP PLAYER, dont say none sense just for talk.

I agree 100% that Christheco's comment was a bit out of line, but using Nation's Cup as a marker for Dogao is somewhat irrelevant at this point, that was over 2 years ago. People's skill level improves and declines and I don't necessarily think Dogao is playing at that same level, he was playing out of his mind then.

dooog · Jan 3, 2020

1111 this is so ridiculous

You take out the top 3 or 4 players or so and the likes of dogao, Hera, DauT, Laaan, Nicov, Vivi, Max, BacT + several others are pretty much all capable of beating each other on a given day.

Sney · Jan 3, 2020

Despite all the other talk: I really like the settings. Homemap and hidden civ. Straight and easy, enjoyable for watchers, preparation for players paying off.
Nili, I wish you a nice and smooth tournament! Be sure I ll be watching

Nikemenon · Jan 3, 2020

Sney said:
Despite all the other talk: I really like the settings. Homemap and hidden civ. Straight and easy, enjoyable for watchers, preparation for players paying off.
Nili, I wish you a nice and smooth tournament! Be sure I ll be watching

Hidden Civ is great. Avoids the long draft process before each series. Hope the break between games are also short.

zuviss · Jan 3, 2020

buhanisson said:
Maybe Nili could also cancel DauT's invitation and replace him with dogao so theres no need for all the drama and feelings of unfairness? Plus, it's something we know he really wants to do and it's his apartment so

he cant man, its part of the deal of being allowed as a secret member

oozkan · Jan 3, 2020

Nikemenon said:
Hidden Civ is great. Avoids the long draft process before each series. Hope the break between games are also short.

But we will miss all the trash talk of Daut. I don't care about zero lag, what makes interesting a LAN tournament is mostly human part. Interaction between players, meet & greets are the sauce of LAN.

Musashi · Jan 3, 2020

Great Hera is joining! There’s no logic in the dogao and fire complaint - there were two (!) qualy spots and they both had a shot to get them.

Hera was a direct invite. If he wouldn’t be joining, neither would dogao or fire anyway.

BTW would’ve dogao or fire attended if they’d to pay it from their own pocket as Hera did?

F1Re__ · Jan 3, 2020

Musashi said:
Great Hera is joining! There’s no logic in the dogao and fire complaint - there were two (!) qualy spots and they both had a shot to get them.

Hera was a direct invite. If he wouldn’t be joining, neither would dogao or fire anyway.

BTW would’ve dogao or fire attended if they’d to pay it from their own pocket as Hera did?

don’t say things you don’t know. Also happy hera is going, looking fwd for all the games tomorrow. Pls quote where I’m complaining here

mercohappy · Jan 4, 2020

I really love Fire and do not know much about dogao,
But Hera was invited at the end and i think Hera is clearly better form than dogao or Fire ( i love you Fire <3 )
If Hera would attend at the begining, There was gonna be only 1 qualifier, but because hera did not accept at the begining not there are 2 qualifiers and i think this is good.
So now with Hera its 9 players and im totally fine with this.

It is not like Nili spoke to some 18xx Players to join his tournament. Hera is competing for top 3 like for 2 months. So please be realistic, it is good that we have Hera and other 2 qualifiers.

Fire you are the greatest after the Lord and Savior DauT

edu2008 · Jan 4, 2020

LaaaaaN and Villese two weakest link. MBL or Vivi can win either of these two easily. Hera's seeding 5.8 kind of under rated to me. Now he is on the same league as tatito and Yo. Fire is a great player, but very happy to see Hera join, he is in very good shape and win the show match vs vivi and straight 4:0 rated DE win against vivi right before NAC3.

Dasso · Jan 4, 2020

Musashi said:
BTW would’ve dogao or fire attended if they’d to pay it from their own pocket as Hera did?

Tbh taking a look at the prizepool and considering he can fight for a spot in 4th place or a bit lower he can easily recover every dollar spent and still gain something. So yes, considering dogao and Fire's skill level.

P.S.: I'm pretty sure the prizepool will be also increased considerably by donations of viewers...

TurboNoob · Jan 4, 2020

aoeZone works fine for me

KolyaKrasotkin · Jan 4, 2020

I am happy that Hera is going and really don't care about the whole "who-should-go-and-why" debate, but a 5-round Swiss with 9 players is pretty weird. Can please somebody explain to me, how the tie-breaks for the group stage look like (especially how the bye-matches are treated)?

And regarding "professionality": There is actual money at stake, that is kind of a definition of professionality, no matter, how casual and cool it may look like. (It probably has to be clarified for some people, that is not meant as any sort of criticism)

JUDAS · Jan 4, 2020

Crawsack said:
So, I'm not allowed to have an opinion since I created my account today? I've been watching the competitive scene since 2017, just haven't posted on here. Doesn't mean I'm not allowed to have an opinion.

Crawsack said:
I think they're excellent players, but they are not at the same level as the top 10, that doesn't mean I'm insulting them. Player's abilities and ranking is also pretty fluid, we've seen some new players emerge in the last year or two, and even since DE was released, and some of the most experienced and decorated players in the community don't play as much anymore and so have fallen off. This is pretty normal for competitive gaming. Just because someone is/was a good player doesn't mean I can never critique them.

Sorry but not a single player has emerged since DE, I think not a single player has emerged from 2 years ago in the expert segment.

Tempires · Jan 4, 2020

Why they are playing loser's map as 2nd map when rules say it's winners map?

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