How to prevent a douche?

[Lord_patito]

Yesterday I was playing arabia, and my opponent was really close to me. He came a douched me (he was persian) and although I knew it was coming, I couldn't stop it. What I should have done?

 

[SaladEsc]

build spots of palisades around your tc

 

[HongeyKong]

1) Scout
2) Build scattered palisades around your TC

 

[Michaerbse]

If you expect it due to the civ pick you can also already build your houses in a way that you block as much space as possible in front of your TC.

 

[IamJeo]

You may want to think of possible goals the tc rusher has:

1) Kill TC of opponent that is aging up => rusher has more vills => can favorably vill fight=advantage/win,

2) keep on tc rushing a dark age opponent that is non-persian (repeatedly), facilitating a wood eco advantage IF the rushed repairs TC or engages in TC fight,

3) block all resource (gold, stone) access with a well placed TC(s).

Frankly speaking, I wouldn’t bother with the palisade stuff except if serious BF and you can get away with just a few palis/houses... if majority of Fin A, who could be considered as the most expert tc rush users out there, are of the opinion that it “always fails reliably”, I don’t see a reason to question that.

With those conditions in mind, you can counter 1) and 2) by staying in dark age and simply creating more villagers, and not engaging persian in TC fight. Eventually the higher vill count should get you to age up faster or afford army to kill all home-eco of the rusher, if you don’t altogether build 2nd TC to his base, getting his own gold/stone if yours are all denied.

Scout the vills coming and cancel Feudal research if need be.

You don’t really “stop it”, you just live with it. If vs a noob quickwaller, you can try vill fighting before his TC goes up, but assuming the doucher is anything resembling capable, that shouldn’t be a likely scenario.

 

[Rayne]

Sounds like you're garrisoning your own vills and trying to fight it. Don't ever do it vs Persian tc, you'll always lose. Just buildup your economy while repairing your tc and he's down 10-12 vills already.

The only 'scary douche' was in the past was when a semi-experienced player (HurleyFreestyle for those who remember his glory days) tc rushed you and feudaled at same time with a trush. Heard some legends of Rubenstock but never seen a game of him doing it.

 

[Socqar]

Sounds like you're garrisoning your own vills and trying to fight it. Don't ever do it vs Persian tc, you'll always lose. Just buildup your economy while repairing your tc and he's down 10-12 vills already.

The only 'scary douche' was in the past was when a semi-experienced player (HurleyFreestyle for those who remember his glory days) tc rushed you and feudaled at same time with a trush. Heard some legends of Rubenstock but never seen a game of him doing it.

The Legend Of Rubenstock!

The mad man just won't stop dropping Town Centers! Previous examples of Rubenstock's madness are linked below, as well as TheViper vs Douche video. Nomad TC ...

www.youtube.com

Here you go, Rubenstock did some amazing douche here and against top lvl players

 

[Lord_patito]

Thanks you all for your help. Yes, I should have built some palisades walls to try to stop it or delay it, and then simply grow my eco

 

[derpina276]

just make militia Kappa https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnrhwfaCEk4&t=1705s

more seriously though, its a bit hard to define one simple way to counter it since its so dependent on map, wether you are already up, what strategy you were going for etc. if you can scout it its a lot easier and maybe you can stop it with vill fighting and blocking with pallisades etc. But in general it is going to ask a bit of creativity from you.

Most important thing i would like to add though is just stay chill and play on. In general people get super triggered and panic making dumb mistakes.

some other general tips:
- if you are going feudal make sure you avoid a vill war at any cost he will have more villagers then you.
- his eco is not much worse dont underestimate persia dark age economy, its a legit strat.
- imo never fight back unless you are teutons or sth, just chop wood and repair if you want to keep your tc. he will have 10 vills in that tc idling so you can afford to have 8 vills chopping wood and 2 repairing its fine. + you should have around 2 extra vills and more resources given his idle time.
- its fine to let your tc die and rebuild it just make sure you think properly about the new spot, dont let him chase you and vill fight you to death or worse get walled in and tc dropped etc. plan it properly and make sure you have the res.
- LOOM!

 

[Carlini8]

Quick Q before I answer and look dumb.

Do Persian TCs repair cheaper or quicker? Is that a side affect of having extra HP?

 

[Memeluke]

I will teach you the forbidden technique: just garrison your tc if you know the douche is coming. The first arrow volley is gonna oneshot his tc, he will be left with no wood no tc and 100 less stone and look dumb as hell.
Everybody builds palisades but if you do 99% you're going to fail and leave a spot, and even if you succeed, he will just build his tc out of range, destroy the palisades with tc fire, then douche again.

 

[Lord_patito]

I will teach you the forbidden technique: just garrison your tc if you know the douche is coming. The first arrow volley is gonna oneshot his tc, he will be left with no wood no tc and 100 less stone and look dumb as hell.

11 definitely gonna try this next time

 

[SaladEsc]

Do Persian TCs repair cheaper or quicker? Is that a side affect of having extra HP?

TCs cost double the wood to repair vs. building one. Repairing from 1 HP to full HP (regardless of civ) costs 550w and takes the same amount of time. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Carlini8]

So Persians pretty much get cheaper wood per 1 unit of HP repairing?

 

[iViktorius]

FYI: 10 vills garrisoned already do max damage, the extra 5 vills you can garrison are useless, better send them to work gathering something.

 

[Influenza]

some other general tips:
- if you are going feudal make sure you avoid a vill war at any cost he will have more villagers then you.
- his eco is not much worse dont underestimate persia dark age economy, its a legit strat.
- imo never fight back unless you are teutons or sth, just chop wood and repair if you want to keep your tc. he will have 10 vills in that tc idling so you can afford to have 8 vills chopping wood and 2 repairing its fine. + you should have around 2 extra vills and more resources given his idle time.
- its fine to let your tc die and rebuild it just make sure you think properly about the new spot, dont let him chase you and vill fight you to death or worse get walled in and tc dropped etc. plan it properly and make sure you have the res.
- LOOM!

8 vills on wood doesn't come close to supporting 2 vills repairing continuously. Repairing a tc vs persians is only ok if you just want to buy a minute or two to secure another tc location or to get up to the feudal age. Otherwise if you get tc rushed by a non-persia it's typically best just to fight it with 10 vills in the tc

 

[angelina_jolie]

Sounds like you're garrisoning your own vills and trying to fight it. Don't ever do it vs Persian tc, you'll always lose. Just buildup your economy while repairing your tc and he's down 10-12 vills already.

The only 'scary douche' was in the past was when a semi-experienced player (HurleyFreestyle for those who remember his glory days) tc rushed you and feudaled at same time with a trush. Heard some legends of Rubenstock but never seen a game of him doing it.

He was amazing in that! And in his forward m@a was amazing!

 

[Andreas]

If you really dislike douches that much, just get a bath or join one of those hippy communities that don't believe in personal hygiene

 

[Lord_patito]

If you really dislike douches that much, just get a bath or join one of those hippy communities that don't believe in personal hygiene

11 did I misspelled it ?

 

[Rorarimbo]

Because the people here are much better players they will tell you to scout and build palicides around or oneshot the moment he starts building it. But because I am so slow and bad compared to them I will usually miss these options . I have had to deal with Persian TC on top of mine several times.

Here is what I think/ try to do (not saying its necessary correct as my level is mediocre).

1) know that by deleting his TC he is already behind.
2) I accept he is going to bring my TC down no point of long repairs.
3)I would try to reach Feudal Age though. In most cases I should be close enough. (never)I had to deal with it early Dark age. But if he deletes the TC straight away he must be too much behind I think.
4) I try to consider my next TC place. I try to secure a woodline plus stone or gold.
5) I try to spread and balance my economy. A mill on deers or a minig camp at a further mine may bring resourses he doesnt know I am collecting.
6) Some times the doucher deletes his TC and douches second time. You should be more prepared this time so building palicides around or a vill fight are options.
7) I try to get some stone so I secure more resources and map. and to limit his options to take resources around the TC.
8) I focus on bulding some military units preferably archers. At his old base he has left some unprotected villagers. Usually berries and wood line. Possible couple of farms and or mines. Those vills are rerery protected as he has no TC to hide them and possible no or few towers either as he used stone to build a TC and may be slower than me to Feudal, too.
9) The military units may be ofc used at home to try and pick up vills trying to go out for resources.

Thats it what I do. Not necessary helpful as Im not good but may be some things to consider.

 

[Lord_patito]

Because the people here are much better players they will tell you to scout and build palicides around or oneshot the moment he starts building it. But because I am so slow and bad compared to them I will usually miss these options . I have had to deal with Persian TC on top of mine several times.

Here is what I think/ try to do (not saying its necessary correct as my level is mediocre).

1) know that by deleting his TC he is already behind.
2) I accept he is going to bring my TC down no point of long repairs.
3)I would try to reach Feudal Age though. In most cases I should be close enough. (never)I had to deal with it early Dark age. But if he deletes the TC straight away he must be too much behind I think.
4) I try to consider my next TC place. I try to secure a woodline plus stone or gold.
5) I try to spread and balance my economy. A mill on deers or a minig camp at a further mine may bring resourses he doesnt know I am collecting.
6) Some times the doucher deletes his TC and douches second time. You should be more prepared this time so building palicides around or a vill fight are options.
7) I try to get some stone so I secure more resources and map. and to limit his options to take resources around the TC.
8) I focus on bulding some military units preferably archers. At his old base he has left some unprotected villagers. Usually berries and wood line. Possible couple of farms and or mines. Those vills are rerery protected as he has no TC to hide them and possible no or few towers either as he used stone to build a TC and may be slower than me to Feudal, too.
9) The military units may be ofc used at home to try and pick up vills trying to go out for resources.

Thats it what I do. Not necessary helpful as Im not good but may be some things to consider.

Wow, that's quite detailed. I like that you assume you're not a great player, in order to give me advice, since i'm probably worse than you, so this advice fits me perfectly. Thanks!

 

[SouFire]

You can prevent it if u smell it, building houses or if u catch the villagers making fast palisades blocking the tc area at 6 tiles distance.

If you fail don't fight the tc, even non persians tc douche can work due a bad response, if you are up just repair it until you reach the next age, secondly build ur tc in other spot, at this point he will probably try to do it again, make a tower from a different spot that can reach his repairing villagers, and build houses around ur tc so after he creates a villager his tc start attacking the near buildings instead of the tc.

The strategy is boring and its goal is to annoy you the most to make more and more mistakes, he will be always behind on villager numbers and economy.

 

[Cuth]

11 did I misspelled it ?

No, douche is the Dutch/French word for shower. It's a lame joke.

 

[Lord_patito]

No, douche is the Dutch/French word for shower. It's a lame joke.

Hahah okey. Yeah, I know it means shower in french, but I was doubting if I had misspelled as well.