AOE-II Hera: Massive delays in tournament payments (more than 3 months)

[ninja14]

Any idea which tournament(s) he is talking about ?

 

[oozkan]

I hate this kind of statements when they don't mention counterpart. How am I gonna help you if you don't say who?

Talk brother, let us lynch, we need drama, feed angry mob.

 

[Potkeny]

Talk brother, let us lynch, we need drama, feed angry mob.

I kind of remember it being standard for MS sponsored tournaments to pay 3+ months later, 'cos MS, even T90 complaining about it (not too loudly ofc).

 

[oozkan]

I kind of remember it being standard for MS sponsored tournaments to pay 3+ months later, 'cos MS, even T90 complaining about it (not too loudly ofc).

Well that might be more acceptable in the past, but we are in a %5-10 inflation period, so basically real prize money is already reduced as one late-penalty every 9 months.

Times are changing my friend, times are changing.

 

[Memeluke]

MS sponsored tournament is guaranteed months of delay in payment

 

[ninja14]

I'm guessing it's the shady tournament which happened in Nov 2022, very hastly organized. Can't recall the name

 

[Zeev]

I think he's talking about in general. This is sad reality in eSports. In other games pros have been complaining about the same thing for years.

 

[DracKeN]

I'm guessing it's the shady tournament which happened in Nov 2022, very hastly organized. Can't recall the name

No point to throw accussations like this (and you're even wrong).

 

[Potkeny]

Times are changing my friend, times are changing.

For sure, I have my doubts MS will continue to sponsor aoe2 tournaments with as much money as before, so I expect even more complaining!

 

[Tempires]

I kind of remember it being standard for MS sponsored tournaments to pay 3+ months later, 'cos MS, even T90 complaining about it (not too loudly ofc).

Shouldn't be players' problem if organizer is not getting money from sponsor. Tournament organizer is responsible paying players not Microsoft. If organizer does not pay in reasonable time organizer should compensate players for delay.

 

[LowEloNobody]

Shouldn't be players' problem if organizer is not getting money from sponsor. Tournament organizer is responsible paying players not Microsoft. If organizer does not pay in reasonable time organizer should compensate players for delay.

I would be shocked if MS was not paying players directly. There likely isn't much tourney organizers can do
It's much easier if the tourney organizer already has the money in hand, but that's only realistic for smaller prizepools and community-funded events

 

[Tempires]

I would be shocked if MS was not paying players directly. There likely isn't much tourney organizers can do
It's much easier if the tourney organizer already has the money in hand, but that's only realistic for smaller prizepools and community-funded events

it is possible but even in that case it is still organizers responsibility to make sure payout for players is on time.

 

[malamadre]

I sympathise with Hera and other pros, but that's just life in general. T90, Memb and Nili don't have a stack of cash laying around waiting to be send out. Sponsors dont give a ****, the promotion was already made. And any bad rep that comes from this will be forgotten once another tournament is announced from the company that sells overpriced sugared caffeinated sodas.

So yeah, Hera probably needs to sell out to Facebook or promote crypto scams if he wants a consistent high income.

 

[LowEloNobody]

it is possible but even in that case it is still organizers responsibility to make sure payout for players is on time.

I think it's more of a communication issue. The organizer has no control over the payment timeline, so they surely can't have responsibility for its timely payment.
What is likely lacking is clear communication that payments will likely take 60-90 days or longer.

 

[MembTV]

Warlords finals was 26 of November and 30 of November every player that gave me the invoice was paid, and I got sponsored by Microsoft, that just a example, myself I had paid always super fast… I should not bother about this topic but when I read this information blaming sponsors or not having control about bla bla bla I really don’t know what going on with other events but my events if players give me correct invoices they get paid right away. (I do all transfers)

 

[Huehuecoyotl22]

From what I and other people have experienced in the last years, 1-2 months are not uncommon, and it depends on a lot of factors.
First the person or company that has to pay the players has to receive money from the sponsor(s). That can happen quickly or can have delays. Probably depends on the people of the finance departments of the sponsoring companies too.
Secondly it depends on the way the money is paid. If it's just an individual who is transferring money via Paypal, that should be quick as well. But if players have to send invoices and money is sent via bank transfer by an accountant (?) of a company, that again can cause delays.
However, considering those things, I think more than 3 months are too much.

I don't know which tournament Hera is talking about, but I don't think it is the Grand Melee, unless the payout of the higer placements (=larger sums) somehow has problems. Because I know from a good amount of players that they have received their money in the first half of February. Which, considering that responsible people were off work for 2-3 weeks in December-January because of holidays sounds reasonable.
(Also, that tournament finished less than 3 months ago.)

So if it is a tournament that finished more than 3 months ago and less than 7 months, it can only be RBW Legacy.

 

[DracKeN]

Sometimes it's just lack of communication (depends case by case). But it's not uncommon situation that the tournament ends with great Finals, there's lot of hype.. And then there's at least 4 weeks of nothing. None informs players how the prize money will be handled, no information given. Then one of the players has to ask about it, which sometimes gets a reply like 'yeah, xxx - (someone you've never hard about) is going to handle the payments, he's working on it.' And after like another 2-3 weeks, players are given an invoice they have to fill and within month they're usually receiving the prize money.

 

[Tempires]

I think it's more of a communication issue. The organizer has no control over the payment timeline, so they surely can't have responsibility for its timely payment.
What is likely lacking is clear communication that payments will likely take 60-90 days or longer.

Sponsor is only responsible to organizer not players. Sponsor might just be paying for their logo on stream for example(advertisement).Organizer is responsible for tournament so they surely do have responsibility for timely payment and payment itself unless sponsor has taken direct role in tournament itself but that is not case most of time.

Even if organizer cannot pay, unreasonable delays should still be compensated by organizer who can pass compensation to sponsor if they have agreed about it.
AoE2 esports is very focused on individual streamers rather big companies so big tournaments have unreasonably high price pools compared scale of business. Would you say same if tournaments were hosted ESL? Most big streamers easily can pay $100 prize pool on time even without sponsor or with delays but $100k will obviously be issue.

 

[Tempires]

@paradox303 instead staying on side on both here and reddit care to tell why is is bad take responsible ones take their responsibility? You have not offerend reason it should work in any other way and be exception to normal life.

If Nili funded N4C s with subs, donations and maybe sponsorship depending on views but because N4C did not perform as he expected would it be okay for Nili to not pay admistration costs(lets say cook's salary and etc.) and flat prize pool he promised?

 

[Uselessaurus Rex]

Even if organizer cannot pay, unreasonable delays should still be compensated by organizer who can pass compensation to sponsor if they have agreed about it.

This is really completely unreasonable and not how any business in the world works.

Transparency is important, so sponsors should have a clear agreement on payment terms, and the players should be made aware of likely terms of payment to them.

In business, 60 or even 90 days following invoice is pretty normal for payment terms, so 3 months delay in payment following the end of a tournament is not unexpected at all - but this should made clear to players before the event so they can plan their finances.

 

[Tempires]

This is really completely unreasonable and not how any business in the world works.

Not sure what you mean. Basically any business will agree compensation, usually defined by law for late payment (missed due date). If you agreed 3 months payment then there is nothing unreasonable happening or need to compensate

If there is no need to pay interest after missed due date of invoice then no one would care to pay anything on time, like in your suggested 3 months. 3 months payment delay suddenly changes to 6 months.

 

[bigus.dicus.official]

i dont blame anyone tbh..if it was me seeing them interest rates the banks are offering these days..i d be rubbing my hands

 

[Davion]

Yo @TheOrderOfShit, welcome back our favorite Chișinău boy ninja

 

[Halleju]

Well, call them out then. Only public pressure can move something. Otherwise don't even start talking about it, because that way organizers who are doing their job also come under suspicion.

 

[dataidiot]

Random fact: due to high inflation rates in the second half of the last century, Brazil has developed one of the world's fastest and most sophisticated payment systems of the world. So next time a Brazilian company offers sponsorship for a tournament, don't hesitate to sign in. Unless it's paying in Brazilian Reais, then you should definitely step out.